VIDEO INTERVIEW Charles Michel on the chances of Iohannis taking up a post in the EU or NATO. Plus: Discussion on the rule of law in Romania, EPPO, energy transition and EU green policies

European Council president Charles Michel said in an interview with G4Media that President Klaus Iohannis „is very sincere and committed to the European level”, but any decision on whether to take up an EU post will be made after the elections. Charles Michel dismissed criticism that EU institutions do not see the anti-democratic drift of power in Romania and said he has confidence in EU instruments.

Watch the video interview with Charles Michel, President of the European Council / Video by Inquam Photos / Author: Ovidiu Micsik. Photo: George Călin

Cristian Pantazi: Mister President, you are here in Romania to talk about EUs Strategic Agenda. One of the key topics for the future of the EU is Ukraine. Tell me shortly which are the main decision the EU should take in order to better support Ukraine?

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Charles Michel: We must provide more ammunition in the short term and we are working very hard with the member states, with the Ukraine government and authorities. We are working with our businesses within the EU to increase the level of production, point one, and it’s extremely important to send a clear message to the rest of the world, including the Ukrainians and including Russia, that we are not intimidated by the Russian behavior because we understand very well. This is what it is at stake, this is the future of our democratic institutions and principles and we understand very well that Russia is attacking the Ukraine but it’s also attacking fundamental democratic freedoms.

Cristian Pantazi: Do you think that the EU will find the means to do everything you said? We’ve seen different behaviors inside the EU and tonight you are going to meet president Iohannis, which as you said many times is helpful when it comes to Ukraine, but you’re also meeting mr. Viktor Orban, prime minister of Hungary, who was quite reluctant when it came to actually helping Ukraine.
Charles Michel: One point is fundamental in my opinion, what we do and what are our decisions. And if you have looked at the two last years, systematically we made decisions by unanimity with the support of Hungary and sometimes we needed to discuss, we needed to try to convince. But look in December last year we have decided with the support of 27 member states to open the negotiations with Ukraine in the field of enlargement, this was fundamental for Ukraine, point one, and a few weeks later in January we made this decision to provide an extra package of 50 billion euros for Ukraine. It means that we need to take into account all the sensitivities, we must be united and this is my task în the European Council, to make sure that we are united, because when we are united we are more powerful and we are stronger.

Rep: Another key topic on your agenda is represented by the EU green policies and the energy transition. We saw in the last months big farmer protests basically all over Europe against some green policies. Do you think the EU should slow down the pace of these green policies, of some green policies and better adapt to the social and economic realities?
Charles Michel: First point, climate change remains a fundamental challenge and we need to be ambitious, this is very clear. But on the other hand it is very important to be realistic, to be rational, not to be too ideological in that field. That’s why the implementation, it requires that we have a look in good faith with common sense: what we can do to reach the targets on the one hand, but on the other hand to take into account the realities on the ground. And the farmers, for instance, across the EU, they play a very important role to guarantee our food security and they must be recognised for their efforts.

They deserve fair revenues, they deserve that we have a look how we can reduce the red tape. They are very often victims of too much red tape and that’s why the European Council is involved and we have decided to task the European Commission so that the European Commission together with the member states, they made clear proposals to improve the situation of the farmers all across the EU.

Rep: It’s not only the farmers that are concerned about the pace of the change, also the industry, also the people looking at the huge changes in the energy sector, but if we look into the history, we see that any time we have a revolution in energy, the old fuels are still there for quite a long time. It happened with the wood and so on and so forth. How do you see this energy transition?
Charles Michel: You are absolutely right and we have seen with the war of the Russian in Ukraine that the energy sector is also a matter of security for the future of the EU. And point two – we need to take into account the starting points across the EU, the different member states. They do not have exactly the same starting point. They have different situations in terms of dependencies in the field of energy. And once again we need to be realistic. We need to avoid the temptation of being ideological and we know that the energy needs, this is the national responsibility of the member states, but to understand that we need more coordination, more cooperation so that we overcome this energy change. It is also fundamental for the industry, for the business, for the economy base.

Because as we speak, despite the efforts that we have made in the recent months, we have still energy prices much higher in comparison with our competitors in the rest of the world, especially in China and including our friends in the United States. And that’s why this is a top priority and this is a strategic agenda. It’s also the responsibility of the 27 leaders to decide on the main orientations including in the field of the economic base of the EU and in the field of the energy, which is a very important pillar for our economic future.

Rep: We are having this discussion in the middle of an electoral campaign. The EU is preparing for elections. Tell me, do you personally see yourself in another top job after these elections? Which is your political agenda?

Charles Michel: No, I have one political agenda, this is very clear. This is to do everything for making sure that the European Council is the guardian of the unity of the European Union. It means that in the weeks to come, the months to come, we have a lot of hot topics on the agenda and we need to make decisions. And if I have a look at the last two or three years, we have demonstrated our ability to make decisions in difficult circumstances. And I think that we took many players across the world by surprise, including Vladimir Putin. I’m certain that he had not expected that the EU would react with this level of ambition and with this level of determination.

So there is a main topic because this is the basis of the EU and we have demonstrated that even if sometimes we have different opinions, different sensitivities on complex topics or challenges, we understand that when we are together, we are stronger, we are more resilient and more influential.

Rep: Speaking about the elections and top jobs, what about the president Klaus Iohannis? You’re going to meet him tonight. Do you think he has any chance for a top job in the EU, maybe at the European Commission or at the European Council to be your follower, let’s say?
Charles Michel: Yeah, I know Klaus Iohannis for years. He has a lot of experience. He’s very sincere and committed at the European level. But you know that only after the elections, the European Council will have to make decisions on the top jobs. I will do my best to help my colleagues to make decisions by unanimity, including for this institutional future of the EU.

Rep: President Iohannis stated publicly he seeks the position of NATO Secretary General. In the same time, we saw that the United States, the United Kingdom, Germany, the Baltic States, France announced that they were supporting Mr. Rutte. Do you honestly think that Mr. Johannes has any chance at all for this NATO position?
Charles Michel: You understand that I do not intend to speak on behalf of NATO. I am president of the European Council and I don’t want to interfere in the decision making process at the NATO level.

Rep: Let’s go back to the EU’s agenda. How do you plan to mitigate the illegal migration? This is another topic on the strategic agenda. Maybe could Frontex be turned into a more powerful force to stop the migrants?
Charles Michel: As you see what we have done in the recent years, we have really strengthened the capacity, the capabilities of Frontex. Also, we are much more effective in terms of negotiating with third countries outside of the EU. We understand that some countries are strategic for us because they are origin countries or transit countries. And if you have a look at what we have done with Tunisia, with Egypt, with Mauritania more recently. And I feel that we need this comprehensive approach.

And point three, there is a real challenge: we need to fight the smugglers, those who are abusing the tragedies of people outside of the Mediterranean, for instance. And this strategic agenda is also the decision to identify what tools we intend to use in the future to have a better management of this migratory challenge. And we need to tell the truth. It means that we should not accept that the smugglers decide who is allowed to join the EU or not. This responsibility must be taken and made by the authorities and including through legal channel of migration.

I think the best way is to be very firm against the smugglers, against the illegal migration. And on the other hand, to have some legal channels for migration.

Rep: The EU’s strategic agenda is fundamentally based on the EU core values and principles. And when we speak about this, you know that we have a grand coalition here in Romania that is very powerful, politically speaking, very effective when it comes to Ukraine, for example. In the same time, a lot of independent organizations such as the Bertelsmann Foundation, some Romanian think-tanks, or even some reports of the Council of Europe, talked about how this coalition is eroding the democracy, is eroding the independence of the justice and is controlling a large part of the media. Are you worried about this?

Charles Michel: Look, I think that this question of the rule of law is fundamental. It’s a foundation of this EU project. In the last five years, we decided to put in place some tools. And I trust our institutions. I trust the tools we have put in place. And it’s not a question only for this country, it is for the 27 member states. We decided to put in place this conditionality mechanism in line with the money, with the financial support for the member states.

We have also decided to put in place this annual report on the rule of law so that there’s a political and democratic and transparent debate, which is possible in all the member states. I don’t intend to be specific on one single country, but it is showing that you understand that the question of the values, the question of the democratic principles, the freedom of the press is something that’s fundamental for the future of this political project.

Rep: Some critics are saying, though, that the European institutions are having a blind eye when it comes to Romania, because Romania is fundamental for the EU with helping the Ukraine, do you think that these critics are right? Are the EU institutions blind when it comes to the rule of law in Romania?
Charles Michel: This is not my impression, because I was just saying that we have a look at the 27 member states. And in the 27 member states, there are debates on what can we do to improve the rule of law. This is something that we try constant effort to make sure that we respect the fundamental principles that are the best guarantees for a true democracy.

Rep: Russia, a very important topic on your personal agenda and institutional agenda. We know there are suggestions to extend the EPPO jurisdiction for breaches of the EU sanctions. Which is your position on this?
Charles Michel: I think that this institution is extremely important, because we’ve decided to put in place this new institution this was one more step for more guarantees in the field of the rule of law.

There will be a debate with the member states. The member states will have to make decisions in that field. But I am in favor of everything that goes in the direction of more support for the rule of law.

We have put in place this regime of sanctions against Russia. It is very important to make sure that this is respected. And it’s why all possible tools through this one, the general prosecutor for instance, or by acting to try to avoid the circumvention of sanctions, this is what we must do. This is what we are doing. And it’s very important that we try to reduce the possibilities for Russia to fuel this war against Ukraine.

Rep: The investigation led by the EPPO on the so-called Pfizer-Gate, the acquisition of anti-covid vaccines inside the EU. How do you see this topic?
Charles Michel: This investigation shows that no one is above the rules and the law. Transparency and the rule of law are the foundations of this EU project. And you understand that I do not intend to comment any independent, ongoing investigation.

Rep: Thank you so much. These were my questions. If you want to add something for the Romanian audience.
Charles Michel: I wish you the best. There are a lot of challenges ahead of us. But I know that we can count on the commitment of the Romanians to be a strong part for building this EU project.